You’ve figured this out already, yes? Joseph goes on about the episode while watching it. Here be spoilers. Simultaneously published at StarsEndPodcast.com.

Watching Foundation S2E05

Space, a ship.

It must have been the Deliverance. We’re flashing back to just before Hari’s murder.

“I’m not angry, I love you.” “I know that too, Son.” Hari is awful. I’ve never understood why people love that line from Han Solo btw.

Scene shift. Pinocchio Hari is dreaming and talking to an image of Raych. Doubling down. “You got them all fooled. They think you care about them. But the truth is you don’t care about anyone.“

So we’re inside Hari’s head and this is about his insecurities. He still sucks though.

“I was your son and you let me die… we both know it wasn’t the first time.“ What the hell is that about?

The scene shift makes it unclear whether that was a dream or a hallucination. Now Hari is investigating his new body. Just pinch yourself, dude. No need to stick yourself with a knife. If there’s a tetanus booster on this ship at all it’s over a century old!

Space. Again. This time that’s clearly the Beggar.

Now Gaal and Salvor are mocking Hari for having legs. And speculating about Kalle. Maybe she wasn’t the manifestation of the Prime Radiant.

Hari says, “My body is as it was the moment before I died.” Great. So he’s terminally ill again? That seems to be a lot of wasted effort.

They jump to the conclusion that Hari’s been cloned. I have a hard time buying that there is a continuity of consciousness in that case. Teevee magic I guess, but it doesn’t work that way with the Cleons.

This loops us back around to “Measure of a Man” again. Specifically, why Data did not want to be disassembled. Except it’s even harder to believe with an organic human.

“Someone wanted you to be flesh and blood again. And after all that trouble you went to, turning yourself into an idea.” That’s funny.

Everyone’s being incongruously flippant in this scene.

The Empire had to physically send someone to Siwenna for an update. These three learn what’s up with the Foundation by listening to the radio. How does that work?

On the Foundation’s religious phase, Hari says, “It was bound to happen. People do love to kneel.” This might be my favorite line from this episode.

Ignus looks a lot nicer than Oona’s World. The Empire abandoned it a millennium ago.

“Negative ionic particles in the atmosphere have caused a system reboot.“

That’s funny, but it made me Google “Negative ionic particles.” They’re abundant and caused by things like sunlight and waterfalls. There might even be health benefits. They’re not going to bring down a starship. Make up some new substance for your technobabble. Star Trek learned that early on when they switched from lithium to dilithium.

“I’m flying dead stick!” “Is that bad?” Is funny.

“Pain is exhilarating.” “In small doses.” They’re really playing up the comedy.

Then the Beggar crashes into a bunch of trees like in Star Trek: Generations. Where’s Gordi LaForge when you need him?

It’s disappointing after Salvor’s arc last season that her first instinct is to grab a firearm.

Trantor

Markley is reporting to Sereth and Rue. They’ve only learned a little bit.

Base personality for Sareth: shy and sad. But that version died with the rest of her family, she says.

“She wants to copulate!” Is funny. But man, look at Day. That appears to be real anxiety! Demerzel reassures him. Are they just emphasizing that he’s insecure, or is he deteriorating in some way?

But the — flirting doesn’t describe it — is off putting. Is this all a consequence of Demerzel messing with him? Could this be a cumulative consequence of mental manipulation?

“Think of me…” then the clenched fist. Uh… okay… coach? Ugh. I’ve had about enough of this.

“Come in, Sereth, I’ve been anticipating you.” This is all so stilted that I’m uncomfortable even while I’m laughing.

The orbital rings were originally designed to be invisible from the ground but C-17 wanted them to be seen, “like a shackle around the world.” Two things:

1. This is another indication that C-17 is insecure. It’s an ostentatious display of his… “potency.” But:

2. Practically everyone is indoors. Why not just tweak the projections on the ceilings? Or have they profoundly changed the nature of Trantor over the last 150 years? Working theory: the writers forgot or are ignoring things that don’t suit their narratives. There’s a small possibility that the vernacular on Trantor is based on the fiction that there are no domes, but that seems unlikely.

Shouldn’t the technology exist to make the room damage invisible? This looks like a college student tried to hide the nail holes in the wall with blue toothpaste.

Now that Sereth has seen the damage around the room she seems anxious to get down to business.

The man needs to be on top! More insecurity? But then all the awkwardness. And things turn ugly. Sereth beautifully turns it around. “I was trying to figure out if it is safe to live here!” But it’s still ugly. Not at all like her chemistry with C-18.

A summary to Demerzel, followed by “we’re engaged,” *awkward smile.* And we learn that Day did have her family killed.

But more importantly, C-17 really seems off mentally, and to some degree that’s mirrored back by Demerzel.

“30 Years Earlier” kinda.

We flashback to C-16’s encounter with Rue. The perspective shifts, C-16 and Rue are watching the video in the present. I bet there’s also a mirror on the ceiling.

Rue wants to see when he selected her from Gossamer Court. We see that Rue is clever, but we already knew that. The important information here is that it’s not obvious when a memory has been removed, and Rue suggests to C-16 that perhaps his memories have been edited. That’s a thought that’s going to fester.

That said, while Rue claimed it’s very hard to tell whether your memory has been edited, she describes a clear discontinuity, the obvious sensation of lost time that is abundant in UFO narratives.

I still think the Cleons would never allow the concubines to have any awareness of the encounter.

Ignus

It’s like another Dungeons and Dragons moment when Salvor encounters a guy in a hoodie. I hope she noticed that his skin changed color.

No such luck. She think’s that’s Hugo. He gives a long narrative that barely manages to be plausible. Don’t trust it.

Back on the Beggar, Gaal and Hari are discussing Salvor’s future. It’s softer than the conversation from the last episode, but it still misses the point. The future is mutable; if you change the big stuff, all the details will be different.

“… an embryo is a very different proposition to an actual person.”

Salvor brings “Hugo” to the ship. She should be smarter but I suppose wishful thinking can be pretty powerful.

Hari is suspicious and asks Hugo how tall he is. Hugo says he’s just under 2 m tall. That’s close to 6’7”. 181 cm is about 5’11”.

Hari moves on to weight and fixates on a difference of 3 kg. The difference of 3 kg between what Hugo and Salvor should weigh together. That’s about 7 pounds; a pretty trivial difference after 150 years, even if you ignore the fact that the two are carrying equipment. Shrinking 8 inches is a lot harder than gaining a few pounds.

On the other hand, I think the writers are bad at the metric system. You’re not going to sweat 7 pounds off in the jungle and it isn’t merely a few beers. It’s a bit much, even if you are being hyperbolic.

It all becomes moot as the sensors detect life forms approaching the ship.

Then they’re in a big kerfuffle which ends with “Hugo” saying “Unthink their Minds.” They should have led with that.

Trantor

Sareth and friends are back at the Banyan Tree. She seems to be learning things about the assassination attempt that the instigator would already know. But the memory audits come into play. They can’t get a Cleon’s but maybe one of the Doctors’.

Nice touch with the keeper’s eyes. But that shouldn’t have worked and Markley is going to wind up dead.

Dusk questions Demerzel about memory adjustments. Day took complete power over that after the attack. Dusk wants to know how he could figure out if his memory has been changed.

They like doing effects with people’s eyes this season.

Markley brings the memory audit to Sareth and Rue. They learn Demerzel is a robot. That will have huge consequences, I think. It’s clear these three never even pondered that possibility.

But this is interesting. Sereth says, “I’ve touched her hand. It was warm and alive.”

Compare this to what Gaal says about Kalle. In Episode 3 it’s “I’m telling you, she felt alive!” In this episode, it’s “I met her, she’s as solid as me, but she didn’t register as living on our scopes.”

Kalle is almost certainly a robot.

I thought Demerzel, having decentralized consciousness meant within her body but maybe I’m wrong. Maybe Kalle is an avatar of Demerzel.

But I don’t think that is likely. I think “Kalle” is actually Dors Venabili, who interfaced with the Prime Radiant to communicate with Hari (rather than it becoming sentient). I think that the image of Kalle is a second attempt by Dors, after Yanna, to put Hari at ease. We’ll be formally introduced soon.

Dawn and Dusk are going to drop a few quarters into the fortune-telling machine that is Cleon the First.

C-1 is no help. “If you become divided, you dishonor me, and what I devised.“

“I am here to give you what you need. Nothing more.”

I wonder how often Demerzel consults this simulacrum.

Now Dawn and Dusk want to see the size of the memory files for all the Cleons. That alone seems silly. I wonder if there will be dozens or hundreds more Cleons than they expected.

They’re pondering if they are no longer at the “top of the heap” or if they are in danger.

Dusk ponders his legacy and what Day is up to. “I should have seen this coming.”

To Dusk: “Perhaps Day did you a favor by giving away your chair.”

Dusk and Dawn’s memory files aren’t suspiciously small but C-1’s is startlingly large.

Incidentally, if they only alter Cleons’ memories so they don’t know that they died I’d like to see how C-14b turned out, having the memories of someone who was colorblind, betrayed, and hunted. I’ll bet that guy was an even bigger mess than usual.

Ignus

Salvor, Gaal, and Hari wake up in a hut.

Hey! There’s that staircase from the trailer.

They find the group of people we saw with telepathic powers earlier. Is this the nucleus of the Second Foundation?

Pa’a introduces herself as a goddess.

This is annoying. Pa’a introduced herself as “remote” yet Hari making’s a big deal of her not casting a shadow. Yet it works; in another Oz reference, Tellum Bond is revealed. So why the “remote” comment?

The real Tellum Bond called Hari “mentally incomplete.” She called Gaal and Salvor to Ignus because of their mental abilities. Mentalics = “sighted.”

“Do not worship children. It is not good for them.“ Does that explain Michael Jackson? My theory has been that he peaked when he was ten.

A refuge for Telepaths, many of whom had to flee their homes before they were killed, like Gaal.

They do recognize that using Hugo’s image was quite a violation.

All that stuff with Raych’s at the start of the episode was Tellum Bond trying to read Hari. “Hari’s very murky inside,” she says.

We end with Tellum Bond learning of the Prime Radiant. “I will find it and break it. There’s not going to be a Second Foundation.”

Still good, but sloppy. We’re certainly off the break-neck pace of the first two episodes. That’s fine as long as we don’t try to cram The Mule in here.

All Images from Foundation on Apple TV+.

You can find our podcast here:

Let’s get back to “Watching Foundation!” As always, here are Joseph’s initial reactions, wild theories, and a few digressions from watching the episode. One digression is more extensive than usual. You have been warned. Incidentally, this is our milestone 100th post over at StarsEndPodcast.com. Let’s go!

Watching Foundation S2E04

In the narration, “If your parents never met, you wouldn’t exist… everyone in the universe is the result of a unique set of pairings. And psychohistory doesn’t care about them at all.”

Kudos to saying the right thing about Psychohistory but on the larger point about whether or not you would exist this seems optimistic. I think if anything had even a minor effect on the circumstances of your conception you wouldn’t exist. I’m not going to research the probabilities involved here but my best guess is that you’re lucky if the resulting individual is as close to you as an identical twin. But it might be someone who’s as unlike you as any of your siblings. Or someone who doesn’t exist at all.

Constant and Poly are waking up on the Spirit. When we see Hober he’s still being played for comic relief.

According to a (very) quick internet search, constant sunlight wouldn’t be good for wine. This from Calwineries: “At the same time, too much direct sun exposure can burn the fruit and will lead to excessive sugar development. The result is unbalanced wines with a lack of acidity and too much alcohol.”

Now I’m pondering if a planet that’s tidally locked could support life.

Asimov wrote about a tidally locked planet in Foundation and Empire.

Radole was a small world – and, in military potential, perhaps the weakest of the twenty-seven. That, by the way, was another factor in the logic of the choice. It was a ribbon world – of which the Galaxy boasts sufficient, but among which, the inhabited variety is a rarity for the physical requirements are difficult to meet. It was a world, in other words, where the two halves face the monotonous extremes of heat and cold, while the region of possible life is the girdling ribbon of the twilight zone.

Such a world invariably sounds uninviting to those who have not tried it, but there exist spots, strategically placed – and Radole City was located in such a one. It spread along the soft slopes of the foothills before the hacked-out mountains that backed it along the rim of the cold hemisphere and held off the frightful ice.

The warm, dry air of the sun-half spilled over, and from the mountains was piped the water-and between the two, Radole City became a continuous garden, swimming in the eternal morning of an eternal June.

Isaac Asimov, in Foundation and Empire

What I really want is a science essay by Asimov that specifically discusses whether “ribbon worlds” could be habitable. I read “Time and Tide” from Asimov on Astronomy, which was pretty good, but it wasn’t what I was looking for. It might be more of a Clarke topic.

This website speculates that the exoplanet Gliese 581g could be habitable despite being tidally locked. It’s out of date though: the latest information is that Gliese_581g doesn’t even exist.

But I digress.

Constant and Hober have chemistry. These two are cute together.

They arrive on Terminus and head towards the Vault.

Trantor

We learn more about Queen Sereth’s motives: she wants the truth about what happened to her family; C-17’s denials clearly weren’t enough. “I know how to employ courtesan tricks.”

Surprisingly, it’s C-18 with whom she’s spending time. These two also have chemistry, a more casual and comfortable flavor than between Sereth and Brother Day.

That’s a great tree! Is it a Banyan?

Blunt as usual, Sereth brings up the assassination attempt. I know we’re supposed to be suspicious here, but was the timing really that suspicious? And she asks Dawn about whether Day had her family killed. This is less “courtesan tricks” and more “bull in a China shop.”

“I was a million steps from the throne” and “then one mysterious crash later, and suddenly there I am“ don’t mesh for me.

This Dawn claims he wouldn’t be capable of the assassination of Sereth’s family but “I am well prepared to think I could become capable of it.” That is an interesting admission.

It’s asymmetric but both of them are trying to play the other; the politics here is dense. Sereth ends with the notion that she and Dawn could have been paired. These two are certainly more age-appropriate for each other. The point of that seems obvious. Could there be something more subtle there? And is the kid always going to have problems stemming from romance?

Now a scene with Dusk and Rue. C-16 implies that dominion pigments are better than what the Empire usually has. Not sure if that changes anything from the gifting scene in the first episode.

They walk by a picture of the mural that has to be Demerzel. It must be her because the solar system motif from the jewelry box is behind the figure. It looks to me as though it depicts the positronic conflict from the last episode of season one. I’m sure we’ll be coming back to this.

They talk about their history together. “I thought I had lost count of my Cleons.“

“You might be the last Dusk, and the first grandfather Cleon” is pretty damn aggressive.

Then talk about how Rue doesn’t remember their time together because as we know, courtesans have their memories wiped. Allowing a courtesan to even know that there had been a liaison with one of the Cleons seems completely inconsistent with how those assholes conduct their business. It also seems like a dumb decision on their part that never would have happened except the writers wanted to go with this plot.

But memories and memory suppression are clearly recurring themes in this season.

Siwenna

“Love itself is inconsequential when measured against the scale of the Galaxy.” Gaal is quite the Ray of sunshine here. Is this her being an unreliable narrator?

Riose and his ship have arrived.

Boy, the transporters in this universe are really inefficient, and filled with unnecessary spectacle!

The first time through, I spent this sequence being sure that Glawin was going to die.

What’s with all these things that look like gigantic antlion sand pits?

This sequence doesn’t add much to the episode except Bel and Glawin are arguing at the end of it. Is that what Gaal was alluding to in her narration?

“By the time you recognize an atrocity, you may have already been complicit in one” is wise, but ominous.

Terminus. At the Vault.

Hober’s “It doesn’t work like this” is a hot take and a correct one.

“Governance depends on me continuing to govern.” Coward.

The vault, first of all, seems to use time lord technology. It’s bigger on the inside of course, but also time passed differently for Hober in the vault, two days rather than two minutes. Constant and Poly didn’t notice even though there was a similar gap between when those too entered. Are we supposed to take from this that time passes inconsistently inside the vault? Are the writers just being sloppy?

“We’re inside the mathematics of Hari Seldon.“ No, you’re literally inside Hari Seldon himself.

This does seem a lot like the inside of the prime radiant though.

Those blue contacts really make Isabella Laughland look intense.

“I see by your robes that the foundation has entered the religious phase.“ That’s a decent callback to the books. Then Hari pats Brother Constant on the head. Who’s a good girl? Who’s a good girl? Is it you? Who’s a good girl?

So Hari knows Director Sermak and he knows Hober Mallow but he doesn’t recognize Poly and he didn’t know that the Foundation had entered its religious phase. Sigh.

Poly gets that the Vault is a tesseract. This makes me want to go back and reread Heinlein’s “And he built a crooked house.”

Hari says he wants to prevent the coming war.

Siwenna

Bel and Glawin approach a dwelling.

“Fleet Supremus?”

We’ve swapped Onum Barr and Ducem Barr. Whoever he is, he’s been sending reports to the empire for 40 years.

Is an oval bookshelf one of those things that are supposed to look science fictional but aren’t?

“Books are for old men.”

Glawin, “Here’s to those who fight and ask why.” Ducem is beside himself with approval!

This is twice now. What are the writers implying?

Ducem shows Bel and Glawin some reruns. They quickly learned important stuff about the Foundation and its technology: jump ships, and personal shields. Bel is dubious.

The “Local Constabulary” arrives and Ducem asks to be shot in the head. Not sure that isn’t stupid. If nothing else it’s a waste of a good character… unless he has the imperial nanobots, maybe?

And again, with the laughably efficient transporters. A futuristic pneumatic tube seems like the worst possible way to attain orbit. Especially without a ship of some sort.

Terminus.

Hari offering Sermak wine that was literally made from his body is way too “on point.”

We learn that the prime radiant is “a quantum computer that exists in a state of superposition.” Quantum computers seem like magic, but maybe not that magic.

Hari is assigning people homework.

Sermak is dismissed out of hand. Constant and Poly get to be envoys to the Empire. Poly: “An agent of peace. Yes. That’s something worth being.”

“The honor is mine, my loyal child” is much better than a pat on the head. I was afraid he was going to scratch her behind her ears.

Fine suit. Now piss off. Lol.

And we learn hologram, Hari, like any AI, needs the three laws. He “had to” kill the warden. “For a god to be effective you have to be intermittently wrathful.”

Then, this, “I heard the warden on my doorstep. How long before he declared himself the only holy vessel worthy of my spirit?”

On the one hand, that’s an apt critique of organized religion. But it seems at odds with a policy of using an ersatz religion to expand the Foundation.

“Let no being presume upon my mercy.” *WINK*

I enjoyed Hober calling out Hari on his BS.

Hari in turn, calls religion “A developmental stage, that all successful civilizations go through.” But can you go through that stage legitimately if it’s all a con? Did the United States have a religious stage? Is it right, freaking now? Is the Church of the Galactic Spirit akin to the US’s current religious status quo with megachurches and pastors using the trappings of Christianity to their own ends?

Hober gets his own homework and it’s not being an agent of peace.

Trantor

Sarath, Rue, and the Handman are beneath the banyan tree. They are joined by someone who is wearing an utterly ridiculous outfit.

The new guy, Markley, is worried. We learn that Cloud Dominion can block or reverse a memory wipe and fool a memory audit. Clear implications here about Rue.

Sarath wants information both about her parents’ assassination, and the assassination attempt on Day. She’s cold and matter-of-fact. Everything we have seen of her personality thus far could have been a front.

Terminus.

The sun has gone down, so a decent chunk of time must’ve passed. Hober is leaving the Vault.

I don’t believe that Hari said Hober could take the Spirit. By the way, the bishop’s claw in the Spirit is named Beki.

It’s actually Constant who calls out the sexual tension between her and Mallow. This could be foreshadowing that’s either good or bad. “I can’t help feeling that this is it” is ominous. [But the discussion on our podcast makes me think that Hober and Constant getting together could be equally ominous].

“Wenus” is funny. I did not expect to hear that name in the teevee show.

We end on a long wistful look between Constant and Hober and a bit more of Gaal’s narration. That narration always seems to be in counterpoint to what we’re seeing on the screen. “With few exceptions, attraction is entirely irrelevant to human history. It only matters on the small scale of the human heart.” I think this is the show trying too hard to misdirect us.

All Images from Foundation on Apple TV+.

You can find our podcast here:

You know how this works. Joseph’s comments, critiques, and conjectures from watching the episode. Simultaneously published at StarsEndPodcast.co. Let’s go!

Watching Foundation S2E03

Space

It’s a slow pretty build as we see the Beggar approaching a planet, presumably Ignus.

It’s tense between Gaal and Salvor. The planet appears to be a dump and Gaal comments that it’s a weird place to build the Second Foundation.

Salvor’s “You would say that” is annoyingly passive-aggressive. Will they follow up?

The time jump bothers me here. First of all, they’ve had some travel time since this conversation started between Salvor and Gail. It should’ve happened already. Or if it seems almost instantaneous to them that they reached the planet they must’ve been traveling very close to the speed of light. I think this is a contradiction that’s going to be increasingly annoying as the show goes on.

The elephant in the room is that Salvor died in Gaal’s vision. There is a heated discussion about whether they can avoid or change those events. Nobody’s pondering how Gaal encountered someone with mental powers. Could that be an implanted image?

There’s that hand that we see crashing to the ground in the previews.

And Hari’s being an ass again. He’s taking them to Oona’s World without even bothering to discuss it with them.

Gaal’s anger about the math not making sense would be better in a show where they were carefully trying to make things make sense.

But Hari needs to go to an abandoned mine, and the Wi-Fi won’t reach that far. Boy, these three are being pissy with each other.

“Uninhabited doesn’t mean we’re alone.” That sounds good but actually yes it does.

Terminus

We see the Vault with Hober Mallow scrawled across it in large friendly letters. I think “don’t panic“ might have been a better choice given that the vault just exploded a guy.

It seems to me that stoic armed guards surrounding the vault is a very unfoundational visual.

Cut to a tense discussion involving Poly and Director Sermak.

“The vault is literally a man.” “Was this divine justice?” “How could Seldon’s math predict an individual?” It seems we’ve got a lot of characters pointing out the flaws in the show. I’m not sure that helps enough.

But “we don’t have time to cry and clasp our icons“ is at least funny.

Now it’s nice that Poly is the one making some sense about psychohistory, despite profoundly non-psychohistorical things going on.

So Poly and Brother Constant are going in search of Hober Mallow despite the fact that he is a “fuc%ing @sshole.“

Oona’s World

There are “autonomous mining machines“ abandoned in the desert. That means robot.

These robots “…sucked the palladium from the pores of the planet; and then, when there was nothing left of value, they were turned loose upon the population. The emperors are hollow men who hollow out their worlds.”

The political commentary here is apt but simplistic.

Then there’s a pretty much content-free argument between Hari and Gaal. Hari is an ass and Gaal is petulant. We knew that already.

It gets a bit better when the conversation turns to Salvor’s destiny. But not much. Hari starts by saying that Salvor’s future, might well be immutable. Then he talks about making small changes in the present to adjust large events in the future. Salvor’s death is a small detail in one of those large events. If the large event changes, of course, that will change! Ultimately the two are arguing over nothing simply because they are both profoundly unpleasant people.

Eventually, Hari says “At enough scale, I am insignificant.” I’m not sure a mathematician would phrase it that way. More importantly, it’s like the writers aren’t even watching their own show. In the last episode, we get that preventing Hari from starting the Second Foundation put the galaxy on a disastrous path. The show has already argued that Hari is NOT insignificant.

Lepsis Penal Colony

I assume that’s Bel Riose but I can’t see the guy from Law and Order UK under there. Joanne says he looks like a character from Planet of the Apes.

The quick scene introducing the Bel Riose at the penal colony is outstanding. We very quickly learn that Riose is compassionate, able to speak truth to power, and steadfast in both his beliefs and in defending others.

This tells you everything you need to know about him for the rest of the scene and the rest of the episode, possibly the rest of the season. Notice how many of the same beats hit in his conversation with Demerzel.

Oona’s World.

There’s a real dungeons and dragons vibe and Gaal gets to meet the image of Kalle, who Gaal tells us has been dead for hundreds of years. This surprises Gaal even though Hari’s standing right next to her. [Note: The handshake here is significant. I missed that.]

Hari sends Gaal away. “if you don’t hear from me within six hours, leave.” Yeah, right!

Korell

This looks very short-hand fascistic, except the leader is in fancy dress.

We hear the name “Master Trader Ponyets,” the main character of “The Traders” from Foundation the book.

That’s Commdor Argo in the fancy dress. And Ponyets turns out to be Hober Mallow, who in fairness, does seem to be an asshole.

He wants to sell a “castling device.” I’ve always heard “castling“ pronounced as three syllables in the chess context, “cas-el-ing.” “Cast-ling” sounds like a tiny member of a cast.

Hijinks ensue. This bit ends in a Kafkaesque fashion.

Trantor:

Demerzel is back with Riose. “I want to see Day like this” is admirable, and I see Law and Order guy under there now. Well, second time through.

C-17 is being a Dick. But the guy in the straw hat on Siwenna is an informant for the Empire. Why would they bother to do that?

Dawn and dusk are merely window-dressing here, emphasizing that C-17 wants to separate from the dynasty.

Riose really gets the better of the exchange with C-17 who comes off as cruel and insecure. Ultimately Riose is reunited with his husband. Now he’s reminding Joanne of Monty Python’s Life of Brian and me of the “it’s” guy at the start of an episode of Flying Circus. [Note: really Jon was right: “it’s the old man from scene 24” is the optimal reference.]

Then, haircut… and BAM! Law and Order Guy!

Demerzel and C-17 are being creepy again. And she has to reassure him he’s doing okay. More insecurity.

Oona’s World.

Gaal and Salvor debrief and prepare to leave. Salvor points out how dysfunctional Gaal and Hari are together.

“Never let your sense of morals prevent you from doing what is right” is another Salvor Hardin quote ascribed to Abbas. It might be less irritating if they called that character “Salvor” and Leah Harvey’s something else.

Korell

The two red robes standing out within the deluge of people is very effective.

Yet another execution in a revolting festival atmosphere. The name of the method of execution is funny and disturbing at the same time.

“I’m rather busy right now” is hilarious. Mallow’s funny. At least that’s something. The escape brings us back to comic-bookish. I don’t mind though.

This whole sequence is great fun!

Trantor

Riose: “A weak emperor needs a strong general.” Loyal to the empire to protect its people.

On his ship: absolute confidence. The casualness with which Riose comports himself is impressive and something I’ve never quite seen before.

We get our first good look at a Spacer who is named “She-Bends-Light.” Are they going for a Native American vibe there? That would be a weird juxtaposition.

Is the Foundation more technologically advanced than the Empire now?

Oona’s World.

I think a planet stripped of all its resources is different from a collection of sinkholes. Strip mining would make a lot more sense. Literally no one is going to go to the extra trouble to mine in a way that leaves easily-collapsable caverns. Looked cool though.

If the mining robots were programmed to go after living things, which seems to be the case, why are they just waking up now? Is the fourth law “A robot may not act until it is necessary to the plot?”

This is too Star-Warsesque for me.

They detect a life-form and it’s Hari. Off to the rescue because the plot robots are after him!

“You have a body, how is this possible?” “I don’t know!”

Because of math? I feel like we’re back to the Mathematicians being wizards. Not only don’t I like that but it can do real damage. Gaal and Salvor’s superpowers were bad enough. If they don’t explain this well it will diminish the entire series.

All Images from Foundation on Apple TV+.

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Spoiler warning, obviously! As usual, Joseph’s notes, thoughts, and musings from watching the episode. Simultaneously published at StarsEndPodcast.com.

Watching Foundation S2E02

Open on The Beggar floating in a storm on Synnax.

The reckoning begins. Gaal ripped Hari out of the Raven. He has been sentient ever since. So that awful black-and-white bit when AI Hari was in the knife handle went on for 138 years. Hologram Hari from the Vault said, “It would be bad for me to have been conscious this entire time,” and that was only thirty-five years or so. On the other hand, Hari was in the knife handle before Gaal got to the Raven. Why wasn’t he conscious then? Maybe it was the abruptness of the transfer. Maybe the Raven’s system woke him up. If that’s the case, why wasn’t he downloaded out of the knife?

The second smartest person in the galaxy didn’t realize that would happen. Besides, she told him she was upset about Raych. She’s had what, an extra day to get her head together? And in the meantime, she’s met her daughter who’s older than she is. Shouldn’t she still be off her game?

“We don’t have time for this Hari,” she tells him. “ I looked at the math. The plan’s gone off course.” This is true but the ship is about to sink again. Isn’t not dying a higher priority?

The plan has gone off course because there’s supposed to be a Second Foundation. This, of course, is exactly what we said on the podcast last week.

In quick succession, Hari meets Salvor, AI Hari calls Hologram Hari “the other one,“ and we learn war between the Empire and the Foundation is imminent.

Finally, they focus on what’s about to kill them all. Hari fixes the computer from the inside while Salvor fixes the external stuff. They get off the planet.

Evidently, you can fix a starship by stabbing and punching it. “Last refuge of the incompetent.”

Also, there’s no way Salvor wouldn’t be thrown off the outside of the ship. The mother and daughter hug was sweet though.

Siwenna, a planet in The Outer Reach

We see a woman (Brother Constant) dressed like a monk in red robes. She has a pendant that looks like the vault. Another monk is awoken from a drunken stupor. He uses “Dear Seldon,” as an exclamation like “Dear Lord.“ Together, they find the corpse of a third monk who was “killed for his beliefs in the teachings of Hari Seldon.“ Killed by lightning.

“They can keep their gods. We are just shining a light on the great force that underlies everything.” That’s objectively funny. How can any religion find that threatening?

Followed by “(Our aura’s) not much use against lightning.”

“Avoid lightning.”

That’s the same joke as, “Doctor, it hurts when I do this.”

“Then don’t do that!”

Trantor

Demerzel and C-17 are musing about a former imperial dynasty. Under that dynasty, Cleon tells us the empire was four times as large. That doesn’t make sense. Maybe this means that the so-called Galactic Empire doesn’t span the entire galaxy, departing from the books. But if that’s true, how was the Empire not already in decline? Losing 75% of your Empire is a big deal. Are the producers just leaving space for aliens? Is this the equivalent of a typo?

Demerzel reports that the memory audits on Dawn and Dusk were clean. That only means that they have no recollection of hiring someone to kill C-17. He wants this “loophole“ closed. It seems to me they have an extra step here.

Demerzel suggests sending Bel Riose to check on the Foundation. We quickly learn that he is smarter than C-17 and prone to, let’s call it “creatively interpreting his orders.”

We see the three Cleons sitting at a meal. They’re being coached to act in unison, something 11, 12, and 13 did reflexively. This is the genetic drift. DNA can apparently be corrected, so why is it even a problem? The glib answer Dusk gives doesn’t satisfy me. C-17 is more determined than ever to marry and end the Genetic Dynasty. Dawn and Dusk aren’t happy.

Back to the Beggar.

That whole give a man a fish thing is too cliché. I’m not unpacking everything here.

But interestingly, Hari points out that the three of them are “decades from Terminus without a jump ship or access to a gate.” Is that why Salvor was in cryo-sleep? Did the Beggar travel for decades with a hull breach? This seems dubious.

Hari says, “First Foundation needs to be kept in the dark. Psychohistory predicts the natural patterns of humanity. Introduce too much information into the system, and you disturb it, which is why the system requires a counterpoint.” He means the Second Foundation. This is straight from Asimov’s books but it’s also why Hari and Gaal never should have been sent to Terminus to begin with. I think the writers may have listened to season two of our podcast.

And now Gaal is admitting that her and Salvor‘s abilities are two sides of the same coin as it were.

The big turning point is about 150 years in the future.

Trantor.

The Cleons dine with Sereth, C-17’s fiancé-designate, called “Dominion” here, and her chief of staff, Enjoinder Rue.

Dawn says he has always been fascinated by planetesimals. Theoretically, more than 1000 in the Cloud Dominion are populated. Planetesimals aren’t like Pluto and Ceres. They’re much smaller than that. Sedna, Phobos, and Vesta are some of the larger ones. They’re too small to have a reasonable gravitational field and there’s no way you could go skating on one. They’re not exactly prime real estate.

“…can’t you simply decant a new one of you and take their knees?” Barbaric.

There’s lots of verbal sparring and jabs. They discuss succession and the plan to replace the Genetic Dynasty. Sereth then pokes Brother Dawn with a metaphorical stick.

And she’s really too direct. “Won’t I be accomplishing what yesterday’s (assassination) attempt sought to do but could not?”

“Assassination by procreation” is a nice turn of phrase though.

Day and Sereth are casual and joking as the two visit C1 and the pickles. Then she quotes a forbidden poem about an uprising. She’s arrogant and thinks she has the upper hand here. She might be overreaching.

The two discuss getting rid of the spare pickles and future clones. This is clearly the plan I had postulated. Is it Luminism and Demerzel behind it? Then talk of intercourse, sterility, and combining genetic material.

Jockeying for advantage. Dominion is small. Empire shrinking. “There are rumors. But the integrity of your hermetically sealed lineage was corrupted some time ago.”

Is Sereth a Luminist? Could she be behind the plan rather than Demerzel?

Siwenna

The two monks are doing a membership drive, and we get to see “the magicians who fly through the air and cannot be touched.” The crowd which was initially hostile, turns curious too quickly. This is a real carnival sideshow, snake oil stuff. Their religion doesn’t appear to be exactly Scienceism since it presents Hari in religious terms, underpinned by mysticism.

The cleric is called “Poly.” That IS Poly Verisof.

There’s one guy in a straw hat that gets focused on. I wonder if he’s a Foundation plant.

I absolutely love the fact that their communicators print out text on strips. That seems silly but it’s consistent with the novels. They are being called back to Terminus because the vault is opening.

“The second coming of Seldon means the second crisis.”

And here is the real importance of the Invictus. The Foundation now has jump ship technology.

Back on The Beggar.

Gaal is afraid that if she goes to the turning point, she won’t be able to find her way back. Have we had any evidence that visits to the future were more than visions?

Then Gaal is inspired by her religion in which she doesn’t believe. She wants to suffocate herself in hopes of getting a vision of the future. Sigh.

Hari agrees, Gaal needs to drown. Maybe we’re not actually done with that reckoning.

But she does have a vision. She sees the Mule who sees that she is from the past. He asks “Are you from the Age of Empire, before Hober Mallow pierced its hide?” The Mule is the source of the coming darkness. And the Mule learns the location of the Second Foundation from Gail, Back in the present, they find Ignis and it’s suspiciously close to them. Then they decide to go there and start the Second Foundation. Seems dumb.

I hope they’re saving the Mule for season three. There’s too much going on here. [And in retrospect, post-recording, I think we may have seen the Warlord of Kalgan, a separate character from the Mule rather than the Mule himself.]

The clerics arrive back on Terminus.

Poly is called the “first witness” and “the ten-year-old half-feral child with a front-row seat to Revelation.”

There is a Director, is there a mayor?

The Warden intends to meet with Hologram Hari when he leaves the vault. Poly, the leader of the church, isn’t invited. The Director dismisses the church as “just recruitment.“

There’s a real left/right dynamic building between Poly and the Director. This could be the Church of the Galactic Spirit versus the Merchant Princes. “I believe in the prophet.” “ I wonder how you’re spelling it.”

Also, Poly is a drunk.

Brother Constant is the director’s daughter.

Now everyone is at the Vault.

The warden approaches the Vault and appears to be praying as he tries to talk to Hologram Hari. This religion is a strange mix of proselytizing, posturing, and propaganda. Thinking about modern religions, though maybe that’s not so strange a mix.

The Vault does not want to talk to the warden. It wants to talk to Hober Mallow. What happens to the Warden here is, I think, unintentional; a consequence of channeling enough energy to speak through him.

Back on The Beggar.

Gaal is worried they’re playing into the Mule’s hands. She and Salvor have a heart-to-heart and Gaal reveals something else about her vision.

All Images from Foundation on Apple TV+.

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Spoilers, obviously. This will work the same as these did for season 1. Some notes, some thoughts, and some musings from when I watched the episode. But if you want to hear more of my Dors theory, that’s on the podcast.

Watching Foundation S2E01

It looks like Hari is having a breakdown but in black and white, so you know… It must be artistic?

Joanne says Hari’s rant is like they were trying to channel Shakespeare. They did not.

Gaal’s narration starts, “Any man can be a success but it takes a madman to be great.”

Back to where Gaal meets Salvor. Salvor’s affect is different; “(Mari) carried me, raised me. But I was always yours, I think.” She still wants to feel special. Gaal stomps on it and Salvor seems crestfallen.

Shift to Trantor. The Empire is shrinking, nibbled away by the First Foundation.

But those rings around the planet are cool. Those must be the “monument” the others promised to C11, even bigger and more impressive than the star bridge.

Well, that’s icky. But we learn that Demerzel, like Data is “fully functional.” We never saw this with Data though.

The tone here is wildly different from S1, then “Just be you, your voice.”

Oh, this is a dream of sexy time and ninjas.

Ninjas. So we don’t know where humanity came from we’ve probably forgotten To Kill a Mockingbird and Seurat and Exile on Main Street… But there are still ninjas?

This is very comic-bookish.

But wait. Is this not a dream? Wow!

We see a recurring motif again with Demerzel carrying Brother Day. Not somber this time.

And there’s the first good laugh of the entire series.

Hari again. Now in living color. Is this the inside of the vault? It looks like a picture of a modular form from this documentary. Did one of the producers see this? They might also be going for an Escheresque mindscape.

Flashback to Hari’s childhood. Mom praises his spatial skills, and Dad slaps him around.

But the spatial stuff is relevant. Hari’s figuring out where he is.

Different surrealist imagery. If they’re trying to evoke MC Escher they’re not getting there. Warehouse 13 managed it though.

Yanna? Someone from Hari’s past. Why not Dors?

“Something’s breaking the future,” claims Hari. “…I need to fix it.”

Some nonsense math betrays that the image of Yanna isn’t really her.

Shift to Synnax focussed on the Prime Radiant. Oh.

Gaal wakes with a start and gets all maternal, looking for Salvor.

Neither sleeps well. Salvor points out that similarity, dreaming of the past or the future. Gaal shuts this down and Salvor is crestfallen again. But precognition and retrocognition (which Salvor’s thing is evidently called (Where is Arthur C. Clarke when you need him?)) can’t be all that different. Which of these two is supposed to be the genius?

My coin says you’re lying? What the hell is the basis for that?

We get to see Terminus. Unsurprisingly, the settlement has grown over the last nearly 200 years.

The narration tells us that “Dark waters are rising everywhere.”

A red klaxon is ringing, which hasn’t been heard in 138 years. The Vault is waking up.

I know that actor. He was the murderer in “Mr. Monk and the Three Pies.”

Yup, we’re in Foundation and Empire. At least sort of. Talk of preparing for the inevitable war with the Empire. Also, these guys: director, warden, and brigadier sound like time lords, oddly enough.

Back to Hari in cyberspace. Now the other character is presenting herself as Kalle, of the Ninth Proof of Folding. Hari figures out that he’s inside the Prime Radiant.

Gaal did it.

Copies of Hari? Yeah, a lot more than two I bet.

Gaal shows Salvor how the Prime Radiant works. The Red line, blue line stuff is pretty effective, but it seems derivative from Loki.

The interregnum is getting longer. I think this is all about the Second Foundation. We’ve talked about this on the podcast. Psychohistory I’d like a GPS or a maps app. But you also need real-time information, like traffic reports to make real-time adjustments. That’s the role of the Second Foundation. Because of Gaal, AI Hari never started the Second Foundation.

This version of Day is paranoid, and cavalier. “Somebody get me a damn blasted robe so my manhood isn’t flapping around,” is funny and odd. “Damn blasted?” Who says, “damn blasted?” Dawn’s reaction might be the funniest thing here.

The ninjas were “blind angels.” And again with the executions.

Day confesses to feeling fear and doesn’t want to die. Says he “feels like a singular soul.” This could be the source of his odd behavior or the result of it. Was this the endgame of the genetic alteration plot? The plotters signed their work with that silly brouhaha in S1. Maybe this Day becomes a Luminist. Maybe he already is.

To Dawn, “Do you feel like a singular soul?” Is a loaded question.

This Dawn is radically different from C14.1. But he still buys into the philosophy of the Genetic Dynasty. Day thinks Dawn and Dusk are threatened by his upcoming marriage.

And this would be a better plan to bring down the dynasty. Convert Day to Luminism. Convince a Day that he’s distinct from the other Cleons, maybe even convince him that he has a soul that the others lack. If he buys into that, starting a family of “singular souls” to succeed him is a natural response to keep the Empire out of soulless hands. Then the Genetic Dynasty theoretically ends.

Demerzel is a mainframe now. Decentralized to where? Or what? Now Day wants to know if their sexy time is indecent. This behavior makes me wonder anew how Demerzel is tied into the plot from S1 and if sexy time is a tool to manipulate Day.

Then, “Pardon me, I have to put my head on.”

The rings around Trantor are populated.

Our first look at Queen Sareth. She thinks the Empire is frightened.

Now we see Dusk. He’s more outwardly disapproving than Dawn. “Foreigners seem more foreign every year.” A tinge of nativism.

Day sees his marriage as a way to address the genetic drift by introducing new genes. Exacerbating the “problem” is an odd response. Dusk says, “Steering into the rapids is an odd cure.” Day claims it’s the boldest one. That doesn’t ring true. If the Genetic Dynasty is the problem, though, replacing it with individual rulers who you believe do have souls makes sense.

Gaal and Salvor decide to leave Synnax. “The Beggar’s tough.” Is a glib, too-convenient answer to whether the ship can fly after being derelict and waterlogged for more than a century. They have a plan to raise the ship leaves neither of them brain-dead. Barely it seems.

Salvor’s back to being disappointed by the reunion even though there’s finally an inkling of progress.

The Queen is presented to the emperors, Day = C17. Sareth is “Doyen of the Trade Leagues.” Do we get the Merchant Princes in through the side door? “Most excellent” reminds me of Bill and Ted.

Right off Sareth calls herself a usurper.

She brings a gift of active pigments, and Dusk is excited; he can’t get these! Is this a signal of the Empire’s decline? She on the other hand is dismissive of Day’s gift.

The Dayparts are called away. Lord Dorwin has drifted into the range of imperial Wi-Fi. That doesn’t make any sense. But now the Empire knows that Terminus is still up and kicking.

“There have been rumors of an alliance at the edge of the galaxy, led by magicians who glow in the darkness, and fly unaided through the air, and whom weapons cannot touch, who speak of a galactic spirit who will return and guide his people to a promised new age.“

Compare this to this quote from “The Merchant Princes.”: “…when I was young there was a small ship of strange men, who did not know our customs and could not tell where they came from. They talked of magicians at the edge of the Galaxy; magicians who glowed in the darkness, who flew unaided through the air, and whom weapons would not touch.”

Demerzel counsels caution.

Back inside the Prime Radiant. “Show your work.” Lol. He’s been speaking to the Radiant itself. “Your work was always incomplete. Perhaps I am its completion.”

“I’ll explain more if you can meet me in Oona’s world,” says the radiant. “You’ll appreciate it down to your bones.“ I think the end result of this will be Dors Venabili.

Hari escapes the Radiant just in time to help Gaal and Salvor escape Synnax, assuming that the “reckoning” doesn’t take too long.

All Images from Foundation on Apple TV+.

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